The Ed Eppley Experience
The Ed Eppley Experience

Episode 28 · 2 years ago

Salespeople Are Built, Not Born


Lance Tyson is Ed's former partner. He teaches sales skills to over half of the professional sports teams in the United States. This is a fun-filled 30 minutes that will give you insight into dealing with millenials, what truly caring about your people looks like and how you can't motivate anyone. You'll even learn how Lance and Ed became partners

Welcome to the ED epley experience. Twenty minutes that simplifies the complex job of managing and leading people and inspires you to take action on what you probably already know to build and sustain a smart and healthy business. Here's your host Ed Effley to introduce this week's guest and business leader. Welcome to the ED epley experience, the podcast designed to simplify the complex job of managing and leading people. Our goal with every podcast is to share at least one proven business practice that will help you build a more sustainable, profitable and purpose driven company. Oh Boys, Ladies and gentlemen, today I had to build up immunity and strength to be able to do today's podcast, and so as I talked more about our guests and with our guests, you're going to see why. My words for our guests, as you know, I always start with words I have in my mind about this person. Number one loyal, and I'm talking if there was a way to have more than being loyal as a descriptor. This guy's got it. He's willing to change and one of the most flexible people. Believe it or not, those of you know him, we may not think of him as flexible, but he really is. He's extremely teachable, hyper competitive and he would admit at times to a fault. But I got to bring back up loyal again, because he is loyal and he's also become a dear friend and he's my former partner. His name is Lance Tyson. He's the owner of the Tyson group and what a story. We may not get it all done in thirty minutes, but we're sure going to try. So welcome lance to the ED Epple experience. Of all the PODCAST I do, I was most excited about this one just because of our history. We probably could do three hours. We may have to. Will See if the audience demands a do over. So we'll see see what happens. But welcome. There's a lot of different ways we could start this, but one of the things is I know from our different conversations that we've had you've been an entrepreneur almost your whole life, but I wonder when you realized you are an entrepreneur, because I didn't know I was Entrepreneuri. was raising hogs and add my first couple businesses. I didn't think of myself as an entrepreneur, but later on I came to realize I was how about for you? I answered this way. My My dad was a entrepreneur and behind me here and see I literally have his ledgers from the s when he was in business, and I never he would always say to me like look, you'll never make any money working for anybody else, but blah, blah. So when I was in I can remember trying to start businesses from when I was little to selling hot dogs at the stadium, Accrus Tar from my house to things like that. So I never visioned myself working for anybody. Literally, Quick College I had two s mess stors. Left the Penn State to to start a company called a Lancet group, and it was right when the wall came down, at was coming down in eastern Europe and I was going to import export. I know a damn thing about it, but that's what I was going to do. And and started a company and with this professor from university in Pennsylvania and he told me what that look like and things like that. So I cold called companies, never sold a damn thing and some one of the companies underpired me. So probably twenty three, twenty four, I realize that's what I wanted to do. Okay, all right, you've trial and aired. Would you say that in terms of finding where your sweet spot was? Talk to people about your willingness to try a number of things before you found the right spot. So I also had a huge love in this kind of entrepreneurially, of any kind of self improvement. So the Tony Robbins of the world, the I just pulled this down for my shelf the other day, which is like, you know, Stephen Cubby's seven half time effective. People probably read it once. Ever, it's probably more relevant now than it's ever been. So I had a love for that and so I decided I didn't love being an import export. I couldn't get excited about it and I loved...

...being involved in any kind of self improvement. I one point I wanted to go to law school just to speak in front of people. So I actually try to get jobs with Stephen Covey and with Anthony Robbins and ended up landing with Dale Carnegie. And in that time period also I had owned, I had bought a several apartment units outside of Pennsylvania and I was talking to my wife. I think we owned fifty four apartment units at one time and that was for me watching Carlton Sheets on TV where you can you can buy a house no money down. I followed the Formula I made personally. Be Responsible for the financial crisis. Two Thousand May, two thousand and nine, because we they were given money away. Like you know, you could buy a home and get ninety percent of apraise value and walk away from deal, and that's what we were doing. But there it. Didn't like that business because I always felt contractors relying to you. I always felt people are lying about the rent. And then I was on the other side selling corporate training. It was a bat. It was a bad mix. It was either one of the other and I didn't like who was becoming on the rental side of the business. So that's from a flexibility standpoint, that's I probably tells the whole story. Yeah, it does. And all of a sudden, I'm the two words come to mind slum Lord. It's act was and it was like it was. I was told somebody the other day I had this is a very young land, so I'm know IFENDORSM now. I had kept having this guy who would write me bad checks and so by, and his rent was like seven hundred dollar. So finally I went to he wrote me another bad back. I went to his bank and I said how much will take to cover this rent check and they said it will take another two hundred dollars. So I deposited the money in the guy's account and then I I got the money. I got off my aunt. He called me up and he called her name me. Could Imagine. He told me how legal it was. I said that any more illegal than claging. I mean one of those I remember banks has bank, Patreet Bank. I just said, you know, I don't know if I really want to be in this business, because I like who I was becoming. That park site was coming out of me. But I've never heard that story at all the time that you and I've been together, I never heard that story. Would hear me at is the fact that I thought I came up with that solution. Oh, it's creative as heck. I love it. I'm frankly, I'm impressed. It would. You'd be surprised what you could deposit another people's account. That's funny. Our audience at this point is probably started to recognize you and I have a history. I'm talking to my former partner, Lance Tyson. So why don't you tell the audience your version of how we became partners? I need a mark and a target at all times and I tell everybody I work with I'm a pool. That way, I need to see it. And so after I kind of got out that that swum Lord Business, like, et Cetera, the investing properties, I'd become a partner in Philadelphia and Dale Karny operations, when end up owning about thirty percent of the Philadelphia region, and I decided I didn't really want to be a partner with the group, not that I didn't love the group I was with or just decided that I wanted to become my own guy. So I my wife, I'm going to interrupt. You need to be your own guy. It's not a one, it's like breathing air. So you need it. You needed you needed to be your own guy. I get that. I would get fired from a very from I'd either figure out how to get to the top of a fortune five hundred pretty quick where they part from. A week so I bought about the Cleveland Operation and which was fledging. Was Bad, and my wife said I couldn't move further than the Mississippi from Philadelphia. So it's kind of boxed me a little bit as like all right, and we bought Cleveland. We made some very simple sales adjustment. We increased sales by almost three hundred percent. And then Columbus was sitting right next to it and was an under another under performing..., with the exception of one thing. They had one guy there that added all the value to the market place and it was a big market place. I didn't know much about it but I knew it was bigger in Cleveland and I found out that Ed ed was the guy there. He was driving all the business of the business. was doing a million dollars and was doing nine hundred ninety nine thousand and ninety nine dollars, nine nine sense of it. And so I had had the CEO Dale Carnegie Come to Cleveland for a meeting with all the Ohio Franchises and I got to meet at there and I knew he was doing that much business and I pulled him aside. I said, you don't know me very well, but it seems like the value of the business is really you. Have you ever, I think this was kind of how when maybe not the exact words. Have you ever thought about buying it and ads said yeah, but you know, he's I think there's also in a spot to that that it was comfortable and nobody was bothering them, and him and I talked about let's let's buy your boss out, and I think John Rockefeller said that if your business is built on friendship it's destined for failure, but if you develop a friendship from your business, will succeed forever. Ed's friendship and I was built on on building a business together, not because we were friends first. Yeah, Oh, yeah, I don't know. Honestly, lands I don't. I don't know that I had ever heard of you or knew you till I saw you in Cleveland. I would concur and I saw you speak one time at a Carnegie Event in Minneapolis and watching you with the headphones on right now and stuff. I remember when I was listening to a go that guy's a radio guy, because voice it's like, no, I'm did serious. I had her I'd run into you one time. You did. It was good enough to remember your voice and stuff like that, but I can't say tell you what the content was. But does the only other run and I had with you maybe two or three years before that. All right, well, thank you for telling the story. That pretty much blinds with what I remember. To all I know it was seismic. It was one of those it was one of big deals that when we started we didn't have any idea how the journey that we were going to be on and what it would take this and whhere it would take this, how we would grow. You're listening to the ED epley experience. Email ed now with your questions for to day's guest to podcast at the eply Groupcom in his book, let's be clear, six disciplines of focused management pros author at epple breaks down key practices of professional management, how to implement them and why it matters. Purchase your copy on Amazoncom today. Develop your competitive edge for the future while building a sustainable and thriving business. So one of the things I know is you are a different manager and leader today than when we first started a franchise. How would you say you've most changed, because you've changed a lot. But what do you think are some of the biggest changes? You mad so I did A and I've come to a couple realizations about myself. I am talking to this guy named Michael Hall down and Dallas and he is an assessment company called a culture index. They only works with certain companies and goes before I can talk to you, I'm going to want to do one on you. And I said all right, and he goes, have you ever done assessment? Says, Oh, no, assessments on yourself. Myself, and one of the biggest reasons for Susan, I did said I would fail at whatever I was going to and that was getting into Carnegie. So he did one on me. He goes your and your an ambiover and I said an Ambi over it and I said the same time, what the Hell's that mean? Right, and he goes, you have extrovert traits, but introvert qualities is, let me guess. He goes. You go do training or talk and afterwards you rather not deal with anybody, just go to your room and like stare at a wall, read a book. I go, it's exactly follow me around. Right, he goes. You hate the network. I go. I hate the network. I he goes, do you tell people networking your sales doing? You Guess, I'll people network all the...

...time, I said, but I hate the network. Right, I think for me in my journey I've realized. I realize the mistakes I've made is trying to be over and extra Vertic, where I'm always trying to force my will and things, and where I've changed more, and I said this morning to one of my folks has before I never really cared about people's ideas right or back on some stuff, and I remember when Ed we start to work with that, ed would always ask everybody Hayes or anything, let me know if there's anything I can do to help, right. So I started asking that question. Then I would. I kept asking. I go she's I hope they don't ask me for asking the question. You Ready? Don't worry. Not that I don't want help. You put it an what I've learned about myself and where I've changed is I'm more into letting people really state their case first before I force my will and understanding the fact that people birth their ideas and they're important in their voices. Important that way. Doesn't mean we're always going to do it, doesn't mean it's just vote, but I think there's plenty of times any small business where you can solicit feedback for people, allow them to check their brain in when they're hard a little bit of change. That way. I have well, and I'm guessing since you are moldible, your teachable, you you learn fast. Sometimes when you take that approach, you actually change your position. You don't always end up where you would. We're going to end up. Yeah, you know, and it it kind of ties in right now. I've been really hesitant to put out a position with diversity inclusion because we do so much promoting business. So I've reached out to anyone of color that I know, and I have three men on my team to her African American, and then the rest of my organization's females. So I really wanted to understand and learning. It's the opinions and one of the guys are worse than his names of Mer hell. I said. So what it explained to me. What is Hewp me understand where you come from, because lands. Have you ever walked by a car and have people lock their door? And that's never happened to me, because I you ever got an elevator and had a woman clutch your purse because your skin color? It's never happened to me. I think about that. But I think of all the I think of asking people what they think and what they feel. This critical to mold the message and I've aged before. I would I'd be like yeah, that's great, thanks for the feedback. I'd be telling you, versus maybe selling. You are asking you to join, you are accepting the feedback, but you aren't acting on it. Now, I wasn't and because that already I already come to a conclusion and I still do. But I need people to buy in, especially in certainty. Right now. I need all my people buy and what's going on. One of the parts the journey of that I was along for was you went from being really involved in training to really and doing it, to building a business where other people were selling and delivering it, to now you've really honed in on and have become the pre eminent guy in professional sports and sales, training, and I mean I believe you've done business with other half the professional sports team the United States. How how did you, how did you hone in on that? You mean getting kind of getting the pro sports business or getting that. But yeah, well, yeah, and and and I know you're interested in sports, but you're not a sports crazy guy. I don't even watch pro sports right now, be frank with you, I like right. I mean, so how did you figure out, okay, this is a sweet spot for me and I can do this as good or better than anybody? And and not only did you recognize the opportunity, but then you went and grabbed it. So to help help me understand how that you know and we don't have as a good question. I think when we were together and from the years that we were together, we were we were so generalist about things. So our training business we were generalist. We we did sales training, we did service, we did leadership, her all over the board. And being in, you...

...know, a great operation like Doll Carnegie, which is a great brand, at the same time they're they try to be every but everything to everybody. So there's no focus at a shotgun approach. So I decided, if I were going to do for us to do this well, I was going to hone in on a couple verticals and verticals and we've always done a good job. You know, the Tyson group is, you know, form going to plug us. We're very boutiquey but at the same time we are a top twenty sales training company. You know, we're also ranked by training industry as an organization that we're on their watch list. So so we're boutique but we're very focused and I and I and I believed. Hey, it's more about that. Probably learned as much about that as from you as anything else, because you are always focused in Carnegie strictly the leadership, right. So that's what you can from. So yeah, yeah, you know my friend West Guy, and I don't think I've had the opportunity to introduce you to but one of the things he said, and I got a prefaces, it's not diversity in people and ethnicity and that kind of stay. But he always says diversity is the enemy of profitability. When when organizations try to be too diverse and what they offer and sell and promote that it ends up costuming and profit and it's an opportunity cost and so I'm glad your evidence for the audience that that probably is is true. Well, I think, I think to what you said. We said so important. Like you know, a lot of people are diverse fighting in their investments. I think a lot of people that I that I know are, you know who are really successful, hyper focused in their investments. So that's that's how and I approach it that way. Not that we don't go after other industries, but that's where I made the change. Kind of be that specialist, you know. Yeah, our surgeon making the probably makes more money than the generalist, right. So if he's that almost certain. Yep. I've heard you address this issue, not just recently but probably for two three years, about what's it like to manage in lead millennials, and a lot of a lot of people have the impression that willennials don't have putting up an air quotes for our audience a good work ethic. What's your what's your response to that? I think it's garbage. I think. I think the headlines and Good Morning America do not a millennial make. So we are told millennials aren't competitive. Its garbage. I think they are. I don't think they share their grades in college and I think they hit their targets. I think. I think if you don't ask in their opinion, they're not going to do anything. I don't think it's any different from an each generation like so that I just I don't believe in I don't believe that hype. I'm just not as an end of it. As an entrepreneur, I'm not into grouping people. I just that is one thing I refused to do. Are there millennials that fit that profile? Yeah, but there's Jen's Gen X. is the for that profile too. I think it's a very competitive group. I think the only thing with millennials is, if you if you want askew to an example like look, they've most of them played organized sports, so they like to know rules. If you're changing the roles on them all the time, it's okay to to change rules. So of other changing rules. Yeah, the other thing you I consider with millennials is this is most of them were the chief technology officer and their home from the time they were four years old. Hey, can you get me on the Internet, dead right there to see that the table. So give a little people table, poll stool up. Let Him. It doesn't have to be with everything, but isn't that like, I mean I follow your brand of leadership, like ask people their opinion, get involved with the individual. Don't eat a loan he I mean I just you look at a company of that as a culture. They are truly have a culture or they have a cult right. Yeah, and and I think when you look at great companies that you talk about culture, how important is all the time know your culture, asking people their opinion, getting involved with him, and that's you can...

...push the millennials. They're fine if people would like to know more about that. Have you written anything about that? Is there any blogs or anything you have? Yeah, I have a Tyson group, camillennial cell. I have I have an article that I talked about even in my book I talk about it also some way game. It's important. It's important understand your people. But you know, think about it this way. It's never, and I'd learned this from you, it is not about motivating, it's about understanding motivation and there's a distinct difference. A hundred percent like and motivation is not a one size fit small no, no, no, God's very good and takes a lot of time. So if you're trying to use big groups and motivate a big group by let you know, I always say this all the time, a lot of company sales companies will do contests and stuff like that to keep people engage. Well, I have two people in staff that bring with me over a decade. Ones Alice Cotroller. She's our VP of training, a strategy. She loves contest she loves recognition. Doesn't make her wrong or right. I got another one has been with me twelve years. Just hate that recognition. But neither are right. They're both them and you got that. If you're going to manage them both, you need to understand that. Earlier we were talked about your evolution as a manager and how you've changed, and I think you're highly self aware. In fact, I got to have a blog coming out soon on the the whole premise that I think the thing that separates great managers and leaders from good is how self aware they are. If people want more about it, it'll be out probably next week, but next week being rout around the first to July. But we had this young man, Andy, who worked for us and he wanted to quit and I remember you did not accept his resignation, which for people in the audience number one. I don't know if anybody has ever refused to accept somebody's resignation. I know I've never refused. So you fought with this young man to stay part of our organization. He did some extraordinary things. Tell the audience about what you did. So what AMMI's resume was coming in. He played football at Mount Union. He was a critical part of that. That's kind of a story. Division three program they produce a lot of good, great leaders and people of principle and things like that. And who claimed to be and he was letting self off the hook. Could just hard work. That's not how he got the job. And I'd basically, you know, I mean this is against how you got the job. This is not what you told us, and I looked out of my God, if I can interrupt, essentially, he told you he was going to be a hard work or give you his best effort. Now he's going to resign because he's not doing well and he had not given us his best perceived not doing well. So we realized, you know, we probably had to give him a lot more, you know, feedback and stuff like that. And I looked at him and I said, well, I don't accept your resignation asign and I go no, you're not. I looked at him and I go, Oh, your mom and dad feel if they never sitting in this office right here, and he put his head down. I go that bad. Huh, I'm pretty disappointed in you. I said so. If I call it on. What would happened? He goes, we're not going to calm. I go, I said, but almost after resume resignations, you might as well go back out there and get to work because like not quitting, it's just not going to happen for you. I would tell you. And if you couldn't do the drubbing, perfectly capable. So that I decided to probably a line here somewhere. I want to I'm like looking on my desk for the line. So what I did is I called the Mount Union had football coach and I u's myself and I can't think of the guy's name right now and this is I think so and he I introduced myself. I said I understand you had a player named Andy Work for you and he goes, yeah, you just hear you. You just why. I said he works from you right now. I go. What made Andy Good? He goes he would just fff and work at the ASS off. I go, what if I were tell you that he started with us less than a month ago and he's working,...

...he's doing well, we think he's doing well, but he's giving up. He goes, can you get andy on the phone? I go out short. Can went out to the pit with his manager and his manager, Tracy's jaws open. She gives you just called his football coach. I got I did and as I what do you think she is? This is really uncomfortable. I said, no, Unorthodox, not uncomfortable. So we marched out, got them when you come in the office and I had we had them on speaker phone. Andy had no clue. I said, Hey, Andy, you'R we have somebody that wants to talk to you. He's a little disappointed also and and he's job dropped. And I said I called them Mount Union football coach and he's football coach was not as nice as I was and I've and he basically, in a nutshell, told her this was unacceptable. You're from one of his former football players and only expected Andy to give a full fledged effort and if he wasn't capable of getting it done, we would let him know. And he believed our organization was organization will help him get to the next level and doesn't stay there for everybody expects greater effort and he and he did well. He moved on over time. But I think that is one of the greatest examples of not all about the only investing in your people to the point of knowing, first of all, knowing enough about him and who he was to know that you know he was. He cared about what his parents thought, but also knowing and being creative enough to and even to pick up the phone and call the head coach and and if you're listening here, like you got to understand also, like it sounds like it's off the cough and he had indicated several times how important those things were to have. We talked a lot about his parents and how they raised him and things like that. So that wasn't a and you might, if you're listening, you might go, well, that's manipulative. Yeah, yeah, absolute, a hundred percent. Is the the definitely the manipulative, the manipulation. The first definition is to act in the skillful matter. That's the first definition. So if you're criticizing me of being manipulative with that first definition, I full accepted not the negative side. I wasn't trying to be dark right. This wasn't about what was going to benefit our organization. It was about what's the right thing to do for this person and not let them give in too soon without really giving their best effort right and and that's and we had a call center where it was was a money, moneyball concept where we were developing people, business professionals. That was the primary goal. Man, we have running up against our end of time already and I have so many more things I would love to delve into, but I have to be respectful of our audience and we promise them always one proven approach or idea that would help them run a more successful and sustainable business. So, Lance, if you could, if you you got other business owners, you got president CEOS or managers and leaders listening to this podcast, if they can only do one thing that will help them run a more successful business in your idea, what would it be? I would tell all of you get out of the idea that sales people are born, their built, and every time you allow a salesperson you think you got a cowtail and build everything around them because they're holding your hostage. You're wrong. salespeople are not in and with that, remember the sales people you will never be as good as you because they're not going to have the enthusiasm and passion of Your Business that you have. But salespeople are built in, not more period. If people want to reach you, Lance. What's the best way? Lance at Tyson group and Hicegroupcom, or connect me on linked in. Lance Tyson, and I'm at Epli. If you need to reach me, it's Ed at the Epply Groupcom. And we owe it to our audience to say thank you. We always appreciate that you're out there listening.

We want to always give you a good product and something that will help you run a more successful business. Hopefully, today you agree with me that Lance Tyson did that. Lance, thanks for being with us. Appreciate your time of you. Thank you for listening to the ED Epple experience. For more information on building a more sustainable, smarter and Healthier Business, visit www the eply groupcom for resources, tips and eds latest blocks. That's the EPPLY EPP l Ey groupcom. Plus, take a free assessment at the eply Groupcom assessment to find out how you measure up as a highly skilled and accomplished manager and where to focus on improving your skills.

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